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You are here: Home --> Forum Home --> Brewing Forum --> Gear/Equipment --> Is a grain mill worth it?

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Mith
Austin, Tx
4 Posts


I invested in a mill last year because I found that Adelberts (a local Brewery) will sell me 55lb sacks of Pilsner base malt for $40. The catch is that it's unmilled. I still buy specialty malts by the lb from Austin Homebrew and have them mill it for me (one less thing for me to do on brew day). So I'd say that if you're going to be buying from your LHBS then just let them mill it. Here, at least, 8oz of grain is the same price as 55lbs milled or unmilled. 



Posted 34 days ago.

mchrispen
Bastrop, TX
485 Posts


Mith... nice to see someone from the area on here. Holler if you need help getting connected into the Zealots or other brewing clubs (you may have already).

I have since upgraded to a 3-roller mill and built a stand. 5 batches into the new mill. Some comments on the differences:

  • 2-roller mills are great at crushing, but not at retaining whole husks. This dramatically affects lautering ability. There is a compromise to find between crush size and husk retention - and it seemed I was constantly adjusting the gap for different malts. Using a fixed gap dimension (I settled on 0.039) I would see massive efficiency gains (welcome, but don't like inconsistency) with Maris Otter or other premium base malts. Or I would have to set the gap wider to mill hard white wheat. I finally settled on that gap size and would mill (or remill) grains separately.
    • None of this will matter much for BIAB brewing. It should only affect batch spargers that use a cylindrical cooler as opposed to the rectangular coolers with a shorter height mash layer.
    • I no longer batch sparge, so mash density is critical for my RIMS system to aid recirculation and fly sparging
  • 3-roller mills, with wider settings have their issues as well. Mine is far more finicky at pulling grains through and engaging. That said, the wider crush (0.045) still produces the same endosperm crush, or perhaps even finer, than the 2 roller at the tighter setting. I am getting far more whole husks, but still getting an occasional stuck circulation. Rice hulls help, but I am planning to move the gap wider in the next three brews to find the sweet spot.

I know that the costs are difficult to budget but worth the increased accuracy and consistency once it is dialed in. Still can be a PITA to get it dialed in - regardless.





Posted 34 days ago.

uberg33k
Charter Member
The Internet
314 Posts


What 3 roller did you end up with?  Pics of the build?



Posted 34 days ago.

ingoogni
nl
314 Posts


Do you condition your malt with a bit of water before milling?

The main problem I see with almost all mills targeted at home brewing is that the cylinders are (too) wide and have a small diameter. Wide cylinders are a nice to have when you have to crush a lot of malt, but also require a lot of force.

The bigger the cylinder diameters are, the less structure they can have and the less they damage the husk. The grain is slowly pushed out of the husk and crushed while the husk stay in tact.

A set of sieves is a nice one to have with a brew-club.




Posted 34 days ago.

mchrispen
Bastrop, TX
485 Posts


accidentalis.com/archives/894

www.monsterbrewinghardware.com/mm-320...

There is the write up - no instructions on the build really. Cantilevered stand design to get good access under. Strong enough I can sit on it. I bought the Monster Mill Pro 3.0 after talking with a brewer. He showed me their commercial mill and let me mill some samples. We checked it with his shaker filters... We opened it up to clean it and I got a good idea of the design I was after. The pattern was more like the Capt Crush from NB and not knurled. I also ran some grain through another friend's 3 roller - it gave nearly the same crush. His was knurled - I think Barley Crusher brand.

Monster supported me pretty well, replacing a bent drive shaft on the MM2 after a friend dropped it and I had a couple of questions about other issues I was having - talking to the owner and getting direct feedback solved all of my problems. Gave me the shaft replacement for free (I think he had some spares sitting around) - and I was FedEx the fixed mill over night. Great company - so stuck with Monster. The hopper can hold about 20 lbs. Convenient for my batch sizes. The extension can push that out to 40.

In for a penny, in for a pound, I used a direct drive geared motor to avoid wheels and belts (seen folks get mangled - and use belt driven tools in lapidary - dangerous). The torque is tremendous and it eats hard wheat like no one's business. Pain to install with the jaw couplings and prevent binding.

In reality - no way anyone needs to spend this much to get a good crush...
was a very fun build however. I do everything overboard, but try to buy once.

I have not conditioned with the 3 roller, yet. Plan to experiment with that later this summer, but it is an extra step. On the MM 2.0, conditioning helped quite a bit, reducing the shredding of the husks and a finer crush... but I didn't see the expected efficiency grains - so I turned back to a slow lauter and saw the numbers I expected. Also - I have since removed the mesh 'chute' and replaced it with flexible bubble plastic. The other caught too much flour. Still have the MM2 as a backup...






Posted 34 days ago.
Edited 34 days ago by mchrispen

davidg
Kula, HI
137 Posts


I'm in the market for a mill right now.  My nearest LHBS is on another island, literally.  And shipping here can be insane if you don't go through the right vendor.  I took advantage of some shipping promotions recently and ended up with some 50lb sacks, but they're unmilled.  The one local brewery we have used to have a mill accessible to use, but in their new location they no longer do.  I'm all about storing a lot of grains

Now it's about what mill do I get?  The MM2, or MM3?  I honestly don't know much about them.  




Posted 34 days ago.

mchrispen
Bastrop, TX
485 Posts


Depends on your needs frankly.

The MM-2 and most of the two roller mills (Barley Crusher, etc.) can be hand cranked or run with a speed controlled drill. Most of them will do an excellent job - but look for an adjustable gap. If you brew in a cooler or bag and batch sparge - then you can crush very fine and only occasionally need to add rice hulls. If you fly sparge (or some hybrid variant) - then you need to adjust your gap to ensure reasonable husk separation and good endosperm pieces, and deal with slightly reduced mash efficiency or extend your mash time a bit longer. You may also want to consider conditioning your malt first with a little spray bottle to help retain the husk integrity. I nearly always needed to add rice hulls for my system.

Because I brew on a RIMS system, crush is critical. I crush very course (relative to the old "crush till you're scared and tighten the gap more" mantra) to enable swift recirculation. The MM-3 provides complete husk removal and a good mill of the endosperm with minimal flour, but is far more finicky than the 2 roller. I also bought a direct drive geared motor to ensure complete repeatability. I can run through a 30# malt bill in just a few minutes and have consistent results.

It maybe worth the spend on the larger rollers but you may need a stronger drive system. Also worth the extra for the base and hopper, unless you want to build your own.




Posted 34 days ago.

davidg
Kula, HI
137 Posts


Is it worth looking at the 7lb barley crusher from Northern Brewer?  It goes for $149, versus the MM3 that is $249.  I'd like to buy once, and be happy with it.  As much as I think I'll be using a mill going forward, is the extra $100 worth just spending now?  

I would love a 7 gal Chronical from SS, but I can keep brewing without one.  My brewing is going to come to a halt without a mill within a month. 




Posted 34 days ago.

mchrispen
Bastrop, TX
485 Posts


Everything I have heard about Barley Crusher has been positive. Not sure I would run the mill at 500 rpm as NB suggests.



Posted 34 days ago.

homebrewdad
Charter Member
Birmingham, AL
2480 Posts


I agree, I've heard nothing but good stuff about the Barley Crusher.  I've taken a long, hard look at it, myself.  If the LHBS didn't do such a good job, a mill would be higher up my list.



Posted 34 days ago.

ingoogni
nl
314 Posts


I own a Barley Crusher and it's a fine machine, indeed don't run it 500 RPM, half of it will do.




Posted 34 days ago.

davidg
Kula, HI
137 Posts


I think I'll just pull the trigger next week and snag the Barley Crusher.  I'll post back on first impressions after my first mill with it. 



Posted 34 days ago.

davidg
Kula, HI
137 Posts


Update: Grain mill is on the way.  I ordered the Cereal Killer after a couple of threads made me realize it should work just fine.  I'll post up a video or something soon comparing the crush I get from online retailers to what this thing does.  



Posted 34 days ago.

davidg
Kula, HI
137 Posts


Got my Cereal Killer and gave it a shot.  The gap I set was to .0035, based on a response from Rayfound.  I decided to just manually crush it with the handle for the first run, and it actually did a great job.  The previous batch with this recipe, my efficiency was 61.4%, and with this new one it was 68.5.  Still would like to see it improve.

The mill was only $99 plus shipping out here, so it basically cost what a Barley Crusher would cost you guys on the mainland with free shipping.  It's well built, the rollers seem solid.  The base seems like the weakest part, but I don't see it breaking anytime soon (and I'd like to make a nice one out of a hard wood).  For 12 lbs of 2-row, it took me about 10 minutes I think?  I can't remember, I was walking back inside and grabbing 2 lbs for each run through. 




Posted 34 days ago.

homebrewdad
Charter Member
Birmingham, AL
2480 Posts


Sounds good.  Once you play with the gap, you should be able to get it where you want.  



Posted 34 days ago.

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